Tag Archives: erblinde

Getting poetry

Here in the UK it was said of our last prime minister that he didn’t ‘get’ it which is one of the main reasons that he was thrown out. In the popular press our current leaders a portayed as ‘arrogant posh boys’ who don’t ‘get’ it either. In both cases this relates to a failure to understand / identify with the experiences of the ordinary citizen.

I’ve given this some thought with regard to poetry and the sad fact that most people don’t feel that they ‘get’ it in that they don’t see the point of it or how it might relate to them. I’ve come to the conclusion that there is only a very small amount of verse that I can see the point of and a very small proportion of that is poetry that I feel might relate / speak to me.

For me ‘getting’ a poem is not the same as understanding it, I can work out what poems ‘mean’ but this does not mean that I can see the point of them nor does it mean that I can relate personally to them.

I’ll proceed by example, I don’t see the point of Auden, Hopkins, Rilke, Dryden and many others because they don’t seem to be saying anything either useful or different. I’ll readily admit that I might need to spend more time with these but an initial period of attention has failed to impress.

I can see the point of a lot of religious verse in that some of it is both useful and sufficiently different to hold my attention but I can’t relate to it, it says little to me about how I live my life even though I understand and appreciate the way that it says what it has to say. I’m thinking primarily of George Herbert and RS Thomas.

There are very few bodies of work that I can relate to in their entirety- only Andrew Marvell and Elizabeth Bishop spring to mind as poets whose work seems consistently ‘pointful’ and relates to my life in the clattering now. By ‘relate’ I think I mean those poems that I don’t have to think about, those that reflect / embody ways that I have thought and felt so that I know instinctively what’s going on. Writing this I realise that I could and should go on for a very long time about how I know (absolutely) the mind and the impulse that made “The Moose” the poem that it is.

Then there are those poems that I can see the point of but only bits of them speak to me. Some of these bits speak of my experiences and some of the way that I think and feel. The wedding reception scene in Keston Sutherland’s ‘Stress Position’ speaks to both my experience of mental illness and to the way that I think about it and does so in a deeply humane, unselfish kind of way. I can relate to and see the point of the strangeness of the human condition as set out in Books 3 and 5 of ‘The Faerie Queene’ even though my view of Book 5 is far away from the current consensus. I can, of course, see the point of the rest and iy is all magnificent but it doesn’t have the same complexity / nuance / strangeness of 3 and 5. I absolutely ‘get’ Milton’s discussion of evil in ‘Paradise Lost’ and this does speak to my experiences of working with people who do Bad (terrible) Things, I’m also of the view that this particular poem is the best thing ever produced anywhere but the description of Eden (whilst technically a tour de force) is quite boring (to me). ‘Maximus’ is nearly the perfect poem in that it contains so many things that tell me what it’s like to be alive, about place, process and the archive, but the material relating to myth just doesn’t reach me.

Understanding isn’t a prerequisite of getting a poem, in fact it can sometimes get in the way. Some of the work of Paul Celan and J H Prynne I can see the point of and it seems to embody how it is for me but I don’t claim to have a complete grasp of what’s being said. With Celan, obvious examples are ‘Aschenglorie’ and ‘Erblinde’, with Prynne, there are moments of absolute clarity in ‘Streak~~Willing~~Entourage~~Artesian’ and a whole range of ideas going on in ‘Kazoo Dreamboats’ that do seem to speak of the now.

Here’s a bit of a confession, Geoffrey Hill’s ‘The Mercian Hymns’ and ‘The Triumph of Love’ are stuffed with point and are two of the finest poems that we have (there is no argument with this as it is obviously a fact) but it is the short poems about landscape that I relate to most because (as with Olson) they put into words (embody) what it is like for me to be in a place. I’m incredibly grateful for this because it (social work term) validates and oddly anticipates the feelings that I have.

There is another dimension to getting poetry and this relates to tactics, There are some poets that write poetry that moves things forward and there are those poets that maintain a / the status quo. It is usually reasonably straightforward to identify these poets. Between 1960 and his suicide in 1970, Paul Celan wrote tactically important poems, J H Prynne has spent the last forty years making tactical / strategic interventions, ‘Howl’ is tactically crucial to an understanding of Where We are Now. I don’t agree with asingle word that Kenneth Goldsmith has ever uttered but ‘Traffic’ is something that I ‘get’ and something that is likely to be seen as quite pivotal.

We now come to to poems that I get as poems and that make tactical sense. These are very few in number because I’m a particularly opinionated individual and (I like to think) my standards are high. There is Vanessa Place whose work mirrors ‘how it is’ for me and who rattles many cages whilst pointing out how what we call poetry can begin to reclaim some degree of relevance in these provisional and vague times. There is also the work of Sarah Kelly that speaks to me but also makes a voice that must be heard above and against the prevailing din. Both of these two set up a kind of imperative (must be read / cannot be ignored) and yet they are utterly different, the only link being what they do to the inside of my head.

terms or the many different ways of writing Prynne 1 (probably) of 2

Michael Wolf - Tokyo Compression image no 50

This is one of those awful poems ‘about’ poetry that was constructed by a machine this afternoon so I cannot vouch for its accuracy.

There is a poem within this poem and I have no idea why it should be there. I have many questions for this poem but I’m not getting an answer.

bebrowed 504
importance of poetry 200
keston sutherland 171
bebrowed blog 154
obscure poems 125
jh prynne 107
jeremy prynne 104
j h prynne 102
the importance of poetry 88
j.h. prynne 73
derrida shibboleth 70
erica baum 65
simon jarvis 64
oraclau/oracles 60
keston sutherland stress position 58
shibboleth derrida 57
bebrowed’s blog 57
difficult poetry 55
simon jarvis dionysus crucified 52
upon appleton house analysis 49
j. h. prynne 46
“cambridge literary review” 44
neil pattison 44
zizek foucault 43
upon appleton house 42
zizek on foucault 32
bebroweds blog 32
prynne huts 28
tl61p 27
geoffrey hill 26
erica baum photography 26
“geoffrey hill” 24
adorno lyric poetry and society 24
aschenglorie 24
stress position keston sutherland 23
jh prynne huts 23
paul celan shibboleth 23
wendy brown walls 21
simon jarvis poetry 21
luke roberts poetry 20
jocund day 20
shibboleth for paul celan 20
geoffrey hill clavics 20
jonty tiplady 20
prynne -hester 20
vanessa place 20
prynne mental ears 19
obscure poem 19
j h prynne huts 19
poems about secrecy 19
“keston sutherland” 19
shibboleth celan 18
prynne poems 18
“j.h. prynne” 18
jh prynne sub songs 18
prynne refuse collection 17
shibboleth paul celan 17
j.h. prynne huts 16
sub songs 16
celan derrida 16
prynne sub songs 16
“simon jarvis” 16
upon appleton house summary 16
stress position 16
keston sutherland sonnets 16
jh prynne 2011 15
“jeremy prynne” 15
poems about having a good time 15
simon jarvis the unconditional 15
obscure poetry 15
j.h. prynne 2011 15
john wilkinson poet 14
odes to tl61p 14
sub songs prynne 14
clever poetry 14
mental ears 14
jh prynne streak willing entourage artesian 14
poetics and politics of witnessing 14
derrida celan 13
foucault zizek 13
derrida witnessing 13
celan aschenglorie 13
prynne china 12
poetry and its importance 12
daniel poppick 12
ubuweb 12
no one bears witness for the witness 12
streak willing entourage artesian 12
aschenglorie celan 12
mental ears and poetic work 12
simon jarvis dionysus 12
to pollen prynne 11
neil pattison cambridge 11
derrida witness 11
keston sutherland odes 11
making of mere brightness the air to tremble 11
criticism the solitary reaper 11
“claudius app” 11
“geoffrey hill 11
sarah kelly poetry 10
arduity 10
celan shibboleth 10
kevin nolan poet 10
“neil pattison” 10
j. h. prynne sub songs 10
prynne celan 10
what is the importance of poetry 10
adorno on lyric poetry and society 10
“robert archambeau” 10
geoffrey hill gillian rose 9
timothy thornton jocund day 9
secrecy poems 9
adorno lyric poetry 9
olson prynne 9
jeremy prynne poems 9
prynne poetic thought 9
j h prynne poems 9
j. h. prynne huts 9
j.h.prynne 9
neil pattison poetry 9
keston sutherland sonnet 9
jacques derrida shibboleth 9
“erica baum” 9
erica baum photographer 9
derrida poetics and politics of witnessing 9
charles olson 8
shibboleth jacques derrida 8
lachlan mackinnon geoffrey hill 8
clavics 8
anathemata 8
prynne 8
derrida bearing witness 8
prynne olson 8
recession poem 8
thomas day geoffrey hill 8
“kenneth goldsmith” 8
barque press 8
cultural criticism blog 8
geoffrey hill annunciations 8
prynne “powre to hurt” 8
francesca lisette 8
prynne wordsworth 8
on lyric poetry and society 8
prynne sutherland 8
“on lyric poetry and society” 7
prynne “poetic thought” 7
metamodernism 7
geoffrey hill oraclau oracles 7
maximus poems 7
hot white andy 7
obsession poems 7
poetic thought prynne 7
andrew marvell upon appleton house analysis 7
simon jarvis and pope 7
neil pattison poet 7
“the claudius app” 7
jh prynne to pollen 7
aschenglorie paul celan 7
difficult poems 7
ashbery 7
poetics and politics of witnessing derrida 7
prynne heidegger 7
geoffrey hill 2011 7
jh prynne poems 7
prynne paris 7
unanswering rational shore 7
adorno poetry 7
geoffrey hill celan 7
j h prynne sub songs 7
obsessed poems 7
paul celan derrida 7
prynne “mental ears” -hester 7
geoffrey hill dawkins 7
keston sutherland wrong poetry 7
prynne resistance and difficulty 7
prynne “mental ears” 6
adorno blog 6
kenneth goldsmith 6
simon jarvis poems 6
“j h prynne” 6
foucault everyday 6
j h prynne interview 6
olson postmodern 6
simon jarvis tls 6
andrew marvell upon appleton house 6
j h prynne george herbert 6
simon jarvis 2011 6
j h prynne mental ears 6
derrida shibboleth for paul celan 6
dionysus crucified 6
prynne “sub songs” 6
obsure poems 6
paul celan ashenglorie 6
simon jarvis bebrowed 6
jh prynne “refuse collection” 6
geoffrey hill clavics review 6
geoffrey hill blog 6
keston sutherland hot white andy 6
zizek and foucault 6
“a crossroads where the dead come to meet” 6
geoffrey hill welshness 6
foucault life 6
jeremy prynne interview 6
charles olson postmodern 6
j.h.prynne 2010 6
paul celan 6
prynne solitary reaper 6
jh prynne prose 6
jonny liron 6
keston sutherland stress positions 6
neil pattison prynne 6
j h prynne geoffrey hill 6
prynne j.h. mp3 6
timothy thornton poetry 5
prynne poetry -hester -amazon -barque -bloodaxe -kerridge -kinsella 5
stress position sutherland 5
derrida 5
luke roberts poet 5
j h prynne charles olson 5
simon jarvis poem 5
foucault everyday life 5
refuse collection prynne 5
importance of word choice in poetry 5
simon jarvis prosody 5
andrew marvell upon appleton house summary 5
celan nobody bears witness for the witness 5
“neil pattison” cambridge 5
laurence crane 5
sean bonney poems 5
streak willing entourage 5
shibboleth: for paul celan 5
keston sutherland wrongness 5
paul celan essay 5
cultural criticism poetry 5
chris goode blog 5
prynne not-you 5
sutherland stress position 5
paul celan quotes 5
“better than language” 5
sub songs j. h. prynne 5
j.h. prynne poems 5
prynne in paris 5
solve paul celan 5
“chris goode” 5
“no one bears witness for the witness” 5
“for the sake of an encounter” celan 5
paul celan blog 5
prynne jh 5
simon jarvis music 5
poem on recession 5
mercian hymns 5
jeremy prynne wordsworth 5
joe luna poetry 5
postmodernism blog 5
“john wilkinson” poet 5
emily dorman 5
no one bears witness for the witness celan 5
lyric poetry and society adorno 5
heidegger prynne 5
lucas manyane fritzl 5
j.h. prynne 2010 5
secrecy poem 5
clavics geoffrey hill 5
glossator prynne 5
oracles geoffrey hill 5
sean bonney 5
explanation of “… and no kind of” poem paul celan 5
harold brodkey 5
example of philosophic poetry 5
keston sutherland blog 5
michael thomas taren 5
short obscure poems 4
adorno lyric poetry and society summary 4
jhprynne 4
william cobbett poems 4
timothy thornton twitter 4
simon jarvis cognition 4
celan heidegger 4
adorno “lyric poetry and society” 4
go blind paul celan 4
on lyric poetry and society adorno 4
j h prynne to pollen 4
bevis of hampton 4
f subscript zero 4
4
“michael thomas taren” 4
geoffrey hill blgo 4
adorno on lyric and society- summary 4
“jonty tiplady” 4
importance+of+poetry 4
prynne triodes 4
derrida shiboleth 4
nobody bears witness for the witness 4
cartography poetry 4
timothy thornton 4
george herbert love prynne 4
solitary reaper prynne 4
simon jarvis unconditional 4
simon jarvis erlkonig 4
j h prynne 2011 4
pyrnne prose 4
marvell upon appleton house 4
j. h. prynne poems 4
cartography poem 4
poetry about obsession 4
celan prynne 4
derrida shibbolet 4
lucas fritzl 4
“mental ears and poetic work” 4
ubuweb photography 4
simon jarvis philosophy of verse 4
shiboleth derrida 4
oraclau 4
simon jarvis wallace stevens 4
paul celan boat poem 4
“making of mere brightness the air to tremble” 4
poetry and philosophy 4
“mental ears” 4
wordsworth solitary reaper 4
poems with obscure meanings 4
adorno on poetry 4
poetry about the recession 4
simon lygo poet 4
solitary reaper literary criticism 4
queer praxis 4
john wilkinson, poet 4
claudius app 4
derrida on witnessing 4
celan witness 4
erlkonig simon jarvis 4
jh prynne refuse collection 4
charles olson postmodernism 4
jh prynne china 4
adorno lyric and society 4
keston sutherland “stress position” 4
celan no one bears witness for the witness 4
neil pattison prynne oval window 4
red d gypsum 4
geoffrey hill and comedy 4
dawkins heidegger 4
geoffrey hill oraclau 4
geoffrey hill j h prynne 4
bebrowed clavics 4
prynne “refuse collection” 4
the pentecost castle 4
ashenglorie 4
review simon jarvis the unconditional 4
a a a domine deus david jones 4
keston sutherland wordsworth 4
the stats on infinity 4
lyric poetry and society 4
“lyric poetry and society” adorno 4
lumen de lumine 4
“harold brodkey” 4
acrylic tips j.h. prynne 4
kevin nolan poetry 4
jocund day timothy thornton 4
keston sutherland the stats on infinity 4
bebrowed’s blog 4
prynne poetry 4
simon jarvis wordsworth’s philosophic song review 3
robert potts tls 3
appleton house analysis 3
who is bebrowed? 3
breathturn joris 3
geoffrey hill oracles 3
poem having a good time 3
bear witness for the witness celan 3
word order, jh prynne 3
j h prynne refuse collection 3
simon jarvis pope 3
dawkins geoffrey hill 3
go blind now, today; eternity also is full of eyes- in them drowns what helped images down the way they came, in them fades what took you out of language, lifted you out with a gesture which you allowed to happen like the dance of words made of autumn and silk and nothingness. 3
to the white lake blot claudius app 3
“cambridge literary review 3
“erica baum” “dog ear” 3
anathemata david jones 3
justin katko 3
poetry importance 3
keston sutherland sonnets cleaves 3
celan shibboleth poem 3
only the brave j h prynne 3
appleton house marvell 3
atemwende 3
milton comus comedy 3
badiou 3
derrida celan reader 3
http://www.grace.benefitsnow.com 3
“laurence crane” 3
edmund spenser romance 3
derrida blog 3
keston sutherland beckett 3
poems about getting distracted 3
prynne hut 3
“grinning cake” hill 3
lumen de lumine meaning 3
deconstruction blog derrida 3
geoffrey hill red tory 3
stress position black beauty 3
wood s lot blog 3
clavics “geoffrey hill” 3
celan “no one bears witness” 3
prynne to pollen 3
sub songs j.h. prynne 3
who bears witness for the witness paul celan 3
“keston sutherland” poem 3
“crossroads where the dead come to meet” 3
“cambridge literary review” + torrent 3
“wendy brown” walls 3
simon jarvis unconditional bebrowed otl 3
word order, poem, jh prynne 3
the solitary reaper criticism 3
prynne prelude olsen 3
gillian rose geoffrey hill 3
prynne “kent johnson” 3
j h prynne streak willing artesian 3
nigel smith wayside shrines 3
aodrno “lyric poetry and society” 3
clavics extract geoffrey hill 3
the solitary reaper execution scene 3
paul celan english translation 3
john kinsella 3
prynne merleau-ponty 3
keston sutherland’s odes to tl61p 3
simon jarvis criticism 3
solitary reaper criticism 3
wendy brown blog 3
“paul celan” shibboleth 3
keston sutherland poems 3
cultural criticism in poetry 3
“to pollen” prynne 3
“divya victor” 2011 3
criticism of solitary reaper 3
upon appleton house country house poem 3
keston sutherland reindeer 3
j.h. prynne. 3
jeremy prynne the prelude 3
simon jarvis cambridge 3
the maximus poems 3
jh prynne, 2010 3
paul celan go blind 3
vanessa place poem 3
having a good time poem 3
wendy brown hamburg 3
geoffrey hill prynne 3
keston sutherland prose 3
what’s new j.h. prynne 3
nigel smith marvell 3
“simon jarvis” erlkonig 3
annunciations hill 3
letter to raleigh 3
adorno prynne 3
geoffrey hill tls 3
geoffrey hill depression 3
geoffrey hill jh prynne 3
jh prynne geoffrey hill 3
adorno on lyric poetry and society summary 3
geoffrey hill overrated 3
nat raha blog 3
dying to belong song list 3
paul celan go blind now 3
celan huttenfenster 3
“stress position” sutherland review 3
j. h. prynne on wordsworth 3
aschenglorie hinter 3
scope of philosophy 3
clean no one bears witness for the winess 3
adorno poetry and society 3
review on mercian hymns mental illness 3
tomas weber poet 3
quotations on poetry and philosophy 3
prynne glossator -hester 3
simon jarvis prosody as cognition 3
“simon jarvis” rhyme 3
prynne’s mental ears 3
on lyric poetry and society adorno summary 3
obscure poetry sites 3
a poem title the awkward age 3
john james in romsey town 3
keston sutherland criticism 3
philosophy 3
oraclau oracles 3
“refuse collection” prynne 3
prynne resistance difficulty 3
philosophy and poetry blog 3
i’ve spent 2 weeks studying 1 poem by prynne 3
clavics review 3
dionysus crucified simon jarvis 3
“jocund day” 3
ashenglorie celan 3
derrida shibboleth celan 3
“simon jarvis” “vanishingly trivial” 3
word order jh prynne 3
‘simon jarvis’ unconditional 3
foucault exquisite corpse 3
postmodern poetry can be described as 3
edmund spenser blog 3
berlin “sergey larenkov” 3
“jh prynne” 3

Paul Celan in translation

As I’ve said before, Paul Celan’s work has been an important part of my life since adolescence. His later poems have buried their way deep under my skin and have enriched my life. I don’t care what his detractors may have to say, everything after ‘Atemwende’ is both important and inspiring to me.

Given the nature of Celan’s work, for those of us that don’t have any German, translation is crucial. I recognise that each translation produces a new poem and can accept this with most of Celan’s work (even when those ‘new’ poems aren’t very good).

There is one poem from ‘Atemwende’ that is particularly close to my heart. I first read ‘Erblinde’ at the age of 14 or 15 in Michael Hamburger’s translation for the Penguin Modern European Poets series and it has remained with me ever since as an indication of the possibilities of what a poem can do. I don’t intend to offer a detailed interpretation – what I want to do is set out the problems that can be caused when a new poem comes along.

The new poem in question is the one produced by Pierre Joris, an excellent translator, critic and poet whose judgement I trust.  I set out below both versions of the poem and then try and explain my dilemma.

Hamburger’s version reads:

Go blind now today:

eternity is also full of eyes -

in them

drowns what helped images down

the way they came,

in them

fades what took you out of language,

lifted you out with a gesture

which you allowed to happen like

the dance of words made of

autumn and silk and nothingness.

The Joris version is -

Go blind today already:

eternity too is full of eyes-

wherein

drowns, what helped the images

over the path they came,

wherein

expires, who took you out of

language with a gesture

that you let happen like

the dance of two words of just

autumn and silk and nothingness.

This isn’t a new poem, it’s radically different poem that walks all over the poem that I’ve lived with for the past forty years. If this was a Felstiner version then I wouldn’t really care because I don’t trust his work generally. Joris, on the other hand, has clearly thought long and hard about his engagement with Celan and has also produced some of the clearest prose on the poet that I’ve read. So, I clearly can’t (won’t) give up on Hamburger but I am forced to consider that my version may be flawed and this is disconcerting to say the least. It isn’t just the words but also the placing of the commas which transforms the poem into something else- something much less lyrical and poetic. I’ve done the dictionary thing and I’ve looked at the original punctuation and it does seem to me that the Joris version is more faithful to the original- but I’m not sure that I want a ‘faithful’ poem. I want my poem back.